Now That Was Truly Painful

Those Hammers fans of a certain age, who have been through the mill, will be perplexed but not surprised by by what is happening to their club, but spare a thought for those younger fans who were seduced from supporting traditional 'serial winners' Chelsea, Manchester's two clubs and Le 'Arse by the brief Hammers renaissance inspired by the now persona non grata Marseilles' captain, currently dropped from the french national team, Dimitri Payet.

Today's woeful and inept performance exemplified the serious issues facing the club, for the first time ever we at the Org are beginning to really question Slave Billic's ability to manage the team! Slaven is a good bloke, he really is a Hammer at heart and is generally adored by the bulk of fans, but is he too nice?

Ok there was the well known spat with Morgan Amalafitano where Bilic stamped his authority on the squad from a discipline point of view, but maybe the birth of a new child and the need for two hip operations, one of which has been done, might have taken Slav's might off the game.

The Elephant in the room that is the 'London Stadium Syndrome' has obviously not helped the situation, a team needs to run out in front of their own supporters early doors to help gain confidence, four matches away from home in a row is hardly ideal is it?

However, Newcastle were there for the taking, low on confidence and with significant injury problems, but they out thought and out fought West Ham.

Following the International break West Ham, currently bottom of the table, will face 'nose bleed' Huddersfield, it could only happen to us irons! -, Ed

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I have always thought bilic was a decent bloke, but I'm beginning to think a decent bloke who "loves West Ham " should be walking by now after a poor run that also runs into his last at the Boleyn. I doubt his self respect if he doesn't. In short I can't see how anyone can make excuses for him. That's all they are. Anyway we can all rest assured, because bilic has recognised we were terrible. Well there's a man with his finger on the pulse! Maybe he thought we have played well over the last 13 months up to now?

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19 users have voted.

Could not agree more Nev. bottom of the league, ten goals conceeded in three games, two of the to teams struggling to score and with their own problems, I think it may be time to consider Slav's position before the season is too old, I for one am dreading our home fixture with Huddersfield, this is exactly the type of game that we will find difficult, but lets be honest, we seem to struggle against everyone. What is wrong with our team? Why when we sign new players of quality they seem to hit the buffers from the off?

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18 users have voted.
mcbikeman's picture

New our defence needed work on it big time but nope get a freebie and a dodgy keeper we'll be fine now a striker who can score...cant knock anyone at the club regarding that bit of business...also a playmaker was something as well...we lost payet never even thought about replacing him so we look pedestrian so teams can push on us and get at our weak defence easily...sideways and backwards passing never wins you a game just thanks from the opposition for making it so easy...the constant use of 4321 without any clue as what to do when that does not work...certain players feeling comfortable because they know they wont be dropped...so much more but others can highlight those....the board i would be surprised if they sacked bilic as they will hide behind 3 away league matches(wonder why that happened messrs brady/gold and sullivan)and transfer business that would just halt if we dont have a manager in place because players would want to no who that person will be.....so 2 weeks to try and get over this dire display and start to a season and hope the players have the guts to front up look in the mirror and admit that they just have not been good enough..although even now i can hear..well the lead upto the huddersfield games not been ideal because of the international break and so many players away blah blah blah....

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9 users have voted.
burkie's picture

Ive never known a west ham team to passing back so much it just portrays a negative attitude. But thats minuscule to the problems at this club , and its gona take a miracle to put it right ,my opinion? The big move ,our greedy owners and a historic ineptitude to face up to whats wrong ,i know i am a glass half empty man but in my view leaving our beautiful upton park will be our downfall

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15 users have voted.
Dicks is the man's picture

I agree burkie. the move may have been 'progress' but I look at huddersfield, brighton and others and envy that they have a real home. we could become wimbledon, homeless having to start over

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11 users have voted.
burkie's picture

It wasnt just a home dicksy it was a legend, their wasnt a football fan on the planet who didn't who didn't adore the Boleyn ground there wasnt any place ike it ,havin a beer in one f the long bars out of them terrible plastic cups before goin up the steps and seeing the greenest of pitches on a cold crisp Wednesday night ,the look on some of the kids faces who were there with dad for the first time ,and the pins & needles when the teams came out .when those three greedy bastards tore that pace down i really dont think they knew just what they were doin,to me west ham wil never be the same again ,i know to some its just an od timer being over sentimental but some mistakes you can make amends ,its the ones you can do nothing about that hurt the most ,and who knows west ham may indeed go on to be a t four team ,they may also have a big say in the Euro cup but if hat ever does happen I'll be watching from another stand ,if you know what i mean .
Funny story ,yonks ago a good mate of mine was saying a last tearfull goodbye to his dad ,he only had a few hours left ,as my mate Dave sat on the bed he looked at his dad and with tears streaming down his face he said "dad im only sorry for one thing ,your never going to see the mighty hammers win the premiership " his dad looked up at him and whispered "dont worry son i dont think you will either "

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11 users have voted.
Dicks is the man's picture

team lacks structure. players look scared to get forward or play with some,pace. its slow, predictable and shocking defensively. what exactly are the two DMs on field for? bilic is a nice bloke, lots of people are but this isnt a job with that requirement. sorry but hes gotta go. I was of the opinion that this being his 3rd season he would know how to set up. buying hernandez but giving him no support is ridiculous. hes trying to play a formation that clubs have with better players. take a leaf from huddersfield and implement hard work and pressing into the team. we look a nothing team. hes forgotten the basics. im sorry but like players managers are in a results business. they have to produce as they bank millions for their trouble. imo we need a change. in hindsight we shouldve gotten silva. but that ship sailed. even whatshisname at swansea organisers them better. only saving grace is de boar looks pants. taxi for them both?

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16 users have voted.
boogerscaravan's picture

As one of Nevs documented old stagers, whose been through thick and thin for the last 49 years. I'm at a bit of a loss right now to be honest. Four successive away games at the start of the season and constantly travelling on the coach must be a pain in the arse. But seeing as how our so called home is a farce anyway it doesn't make much difference. I don't think it's time to pull the plug on Slav yet. I think the dynamic porno duo will give him until after the Huddersfield game. If that becomes an embarrassment, he's sure to be history, as the business cant survive. Yes it's a shame when our beloved West Ham becomes that, but that's the way it is.

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13 users have voted.

Trying to be positive, what does bilic offer us? ......... Exactly. That in itself means he gets the Spanish archer.

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8 users have voted.
La Vida Hammer's picture

going into this game after watching mid week, we did not look like a team worth millions, could not hold, pass or control the ball, basic stuff. Today was dreadful, ashamed to be a WH fan at the moment. Give me a day as manager let me kick some arse and tell a few home truths, 50% of the team are not currently good enough to play in the PL

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13 users have voted.

Watched the game v cheltenham & we had a really strong side out,but apart from the goals,most of the game we struggled against a side from div 2 FFS...We are the worst side in the prem at the moment by a country mile,& that pains me to say it...also forget the fee being the stumbling block for carvalho,he aint gonna come to a side rock bottom of the prem playing with zero confidence...
Look at the players today -Hart,zaballetta,oggbonna,fernandes,ayew,rice (sorry he may be 1 for the future) but wtf was he doing!!Fonte,theres more that ive probably forgot,These players are just not good enough!!

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15 users have voted.
asheshammer's picture

Even then I could not believe 3-0. Changes need making. (1) in the side: Hart has to go, shape needs changing, Hernandez needs support; (2) in the management: time for Slav to walk, period, and all his assistants too; (3) in the Board: it now appears clear that the move to the OS was a joke. You gotta walk the walk. I truly fear what "coming home" will mean for the Hammers. If they were coming back to the Boleyn, different story. SMH, big time.

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14 users have voted.
Essexhammer's picture

Bilic out and all his coaches....problem solved!

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8 users have voted.

How?

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5 users have voted.
plaistow-man's picture

I was at the game and nothing to smile about , as pointed the pass backs which leave Hart only one option and that was to lump it. Too much head tennis and poor movement. Has Bilic lost the dressing room? Have some of the new arrivals upset the team ethic and rythm?
If Slav goes who realistically replace him? just who is available? I like the guys passion but to me some of the backroom needs to go! We need someone tactically astute and maybe just maybe time to blood Martinez, Haksobanovic and Kemp? Samuelson to me cannot be any worse than Fernandes .
We were second to every ball, had no cohesion in defence or midfield and the players need a lift but also need to learn to keep the ball on the floor, pass and move into space . We just cannot seem to do the basics which to me is more worrying than anything and if it was not for Collins the score would I fear would have been worse.

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11 users have voted.

Can't see why the new players could get blamed for upsetting team ethic or rhythm as this was exactly the same before they arrived! We have neither rhythm or team ethic for over a year now! As for people blaming players not being good enough for prem, I say they were all good enough before bilic got his hands on them, I say they are still all good enough. How often do we hear snodgrass, not good enough, fonte not good enough, ayew not good enough arnie not good enough. Well they were good enough as prem players at their previous clubs, yet within a month they all look poor and the common denominator is bilic! Put along side them zaza, not good enough, nortveldt not good enough, feghouli not good enough and calleri not good enough. I refuse to believe all these players are all not good enough immediately after they signed for us. Once again common denominator bilic. Add to that he thinks Oxford isn't good enough, Cullen isn't good enough and Burke isn't good enough. It's crazy and unrealistic to think they are ALL not good enough to play in the prem. are we prepared to say yes all 11 are not good enough or it's just 1 manager? I said last season bilic is not getting the best out of players and I stick to that until another decent manager proves me wrong. Bilic gets so little out of a decent squad of players clubs would bust a gut to have.

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10 users have voted.

I agree there needs to be a change of manager,but its nothing new weve had loads of them over the years...
Do you really believe that some of the players weve bought in really give a hoot one way or the other about westham??,hart - no one would touch him with a barge poll apart from us,free transfer mega wages,zabaletta free transfer,mega wage packet at the end of his career,ayew-panic buy to appease the fans,fernandes-never been prem material imo,fonte-one more mega pay packet at the end of his career,same with snodgrass...
I stand corrected hart-loan deal,not that that makes any difference!!

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8 users have voted.
moore 6 legend's picture

Well your definitely proving it to be I told you so about slav red,I'm struggling to defend him now,always backed him,thanks for the last season at the Boleyn, but since then it's gone from bad to worse..

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19 users have voted.

Sorry Mooro, but it's one case I don't want to be "I told you so" I'd rather be made to look a fool. All I want is some decent football worth watching. In a team that I can at least see what they are trying to do. I'm baffled by organisation, formation, and what we are trying to do or improve on. Can you imagine how a player is if he feels the same?

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15 users have voted.
moore 6 legend's picture

yes,i was reading what snoddy was saying about slav,does make you wonder why all the other players,that have come to us,have turn into crap overnight

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14 users have voted.

How else can I describe this performance. Could call it in pure Canadian as garbage. Every time that the Hammers got the ball, they were shut down by the Newcastle players. Even Joe Hart was when he tried to clear the ball into a Newcastle player and was spared the blushes when the rebound missed the net. Yet when Newcastle had the ball they were made to look like Barcelona. The midfield looked very static, the passing even towards the end of the match when Hammers were three down, was defender to defender to midfielder, back to defender, then back to the keeper. No one stood out. However, clearly the fourth official was around to ensure that Hernandez had fouled a player and he got a yellow card for that. Where did that official go when that Mitrovic did an Arnautovic on Hernandez with an elbow in the face? Instead of a clear red, to add insult to injury, Mitrovic ended up embarrassing the Hammers with cooly netting the third. Sums up our season so far, where a kind of game changer did not materialise in the last ten or so minutes. I agree that our youth coach will do a more effective job than Bilic. Thirty five more long and agonising games to go with the type of Premier League performances we have seen so far. It is rumoured that the two Davids are eyeing Benitez to take over from Bilic, and that maybe the reason why they have ended their interest in Carvalho from Sporting Lisbon. Will Benitez even consider accepting such a huge task reorganising a team that plays with very little passion and were not energetic enough to close down the Newcastle players when they had the ball.

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10 users have voted.
mcbikeman's picture

huddersfield/spuds/swansea.....we cannot afford to fail in any of those matches but with bilic clearly not having a clue as to why we are such a mess and players already coming out with excuses we need a large broom to sweep all this rubbish away and like it or not with the two week break now is the time to be ruthless....but this is west ham it wont happen we all no that...its like the infamous death by a thousand cuts and we are watching the demise of our club...no home no passion no ability the old adage couldn't run a piss up in a brewery comes to mind..

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12 users have voted.

It is like the death of 1000 cuts and that's why I won't be a part of it ATM. I won't go and won't even follow the whole thing online, the radio or down the pub anymore. I'm not a masocist. There is so much wrong on the field it has to start on the training ground. If I had to make an educated guess I'd say it's the culture around the club bilic has created. It's too lax and players as humans are taking advantage of it because it's not stamped out. A tough manager would stamp that out almost overnight. Shock, this squad IS good enough to be in the top half at a breeze. And so was last years. They were/are just been made to look otherwise by an incompetent idiot at the helm and his buddies. People get annoyed Bout players milking the club of wages, well here's your biggest culprit

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17 users have voted.
harrythehammers's picture

Couldnt agree more. Bilic just stands on the touchline looking like a little boy who has just lost a game for the umpteenth time and cant understand why the others dont let him win now and again. Its so unfair !! He is totally clueless , bereft of any talent as a man manager and tactitian. He simply has to go but probably just like Noble because he is ex west ham the board will keep him and we might win a match or two and will be crossing our fingers that there are 3 teams worse than us so we avoid relegation.

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8 users have voted.

After 50 years, I didn't renew my season ticket. The new stadium was just a big pain, climbing 120 steps to see some small players in the distance.The squad is strong but they clearly are not playing for the manager.When you watch other teams, there is passion and fight, when you watch West Ham there is surrender at the first opportunity.That must be down to the manager so regrettably its time to say Goodnight Slav and thanks for the memories.

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9 users have voted.

Is it possible the board the board don't want to pay bilic off? Maybe they can get him if they check his FIFA licence? Surely it worth looking at? Has anyone ever seen it at the club? Is it fake? I hear you can get some good forgeries nowadays. Where did he get his licence from? And who signed it? M. Mouse. These are all questions I'd be looking at.

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15 users have voted.

We are only 3 points behind the Arse!!

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15 users have voted.
North Bank Hammer's picture

I won't join in with any knocking of him I'm sure as Nev says he's a good bloke and an one of us. It is time to go because he is clearly struggling and it's not doing him any good. While it's still very early in the season things can be turned around quickly with the right man in place, we certainly have a decent amount of quality in the squad so now is the best time to make the change for everybody. The question is, who is the best man? For the state we're in I'm thinking return of the Sam and build from there.

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18 users have voted.
La Vida Hammer's picture

Now is a good time, we leave it, he wins against Huddersfield and it will prolong the inevitable.

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12 users have voted.
asheshammer's picture

First thing I picked up is how bad the midfield was. Toronto said "static" and that is right. I saw absolutely nothing to give me any encouragement that we could move the ball or stop opponents from moving it. When Lanzini first came on there was a little bit of a change, so maybe that's encouraging. Kouyate, I thought, was awful. Noble was invisible, except when he was doing something that could have got him sent off. The problem in midfield is what makes our backs look so bad; when the midfield is as porous as it was: opponents can play through balls at speed; opponents can get behind defenders in wide positions; opponents can get four players into the box for crosses -- in my view that more than anything else is the source of this particular loss. Same thing going forward, er, if you call passing back going forward. No midfield means no outlets, and no outlets mean hoofball. The only play I thought dimly worthy of remembering was Cresswells long shot and Hernandez getting on the rebound -- again he showed that bit of quality we desperately need more of. I criticised Hart enough: he didn't look any worse (or better) than Adrian. One big mistake, a couple of good saves, neither very good nor very bad. Same with Zabaleta; did some decent stuff and wasn't quick enough in other cases. So I don't think the new signings are to blame for this mess. But we need better, and we desperately need new management and staff because the players CAN'T be that bad, can they?

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14 users have voted.
Dicks is the man's picture

my issue is if we keep bilic and things pick up slightly….is he the man to take this club forwards? lets say we creep a win over Huddersfield which at the moment looks unlikely as they work 10 tens harder than we do, and the board says bilic is turning it round….then what? for me I've seen too much of mess ups, predictable line ups, shocking defending to believe this is a manager who can take us to the next step.

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11 users have voted.
asheshammer's picture

Now is the time to make the move. "Strike while the Irons are Cold" if you will.

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8 users have voted.

Yep keeping hold of bilic is nothing more than flogging a dead horse. He may fluke a win v Huddersfield but it's just a waste of the next 3 or 4 games afterwards. I heard they will decide at the next internationals not this. If so what's the point? Bilic has shown what he has got why does anyone expect anything different all of a sudden? The only significant thing is that the transfer window will be closed. At the end of last season he at least should have been told if he doesn't change his back room staff he will go.

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16 users have voted.

Is that really how we judge a manager? Who is it we want instead? I know, lets call that Allardyce chap who seems to be rather good at turning round failing clubs...

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14 users have voted.

4 games? Mm you must have forgotten the 40 odd last season?

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15 users have voted.
Dicks is the man's picture

you sign up for prem league management, you gotta expect a poor start and you could be on your way. its no longer a job of building for future, its here and now. hes had 2 seasons so thats plenty to be progressing. do we see progress?

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12 users have voted.
Deluded Hammer's picture

Have let Allardyce go in the first place. Done wonders managing this club with one hand tied behind his back. And one thing he got spot on was calling the fans deluded.

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12 users have voted.
Dicks is the man's picture

lol, he went stale like Bilic. did you forget the last season of his reign?

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14 users have voted.
Deluded Hammer's picture

I haven't forgotten the end of his reign at all. Very difficult to motivate players when everyone knows he going out the door. What with the injuries he was coping with plus ungrateful fans and owners with no backbone and plenty to say in the press. Nope. Not forgotten at all. Stale, you say. OK

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17 users have voted.
asheshammer's picture

ARE you Sam Allardyce? ;)

But seriously, to his credit: made sure the team were organised, especially in defence; kept us in most games. Downside: mostly boring football, even in the Championship where he had a team that could boss the league. Negative attitude towards the developing players. Set up not to lose.

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6 users have voted.
Dicks is the man's picture

always said he did a good job. it was time to go though. the football being dire is ok if your getting results but if not theres no way to justify it.

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5 users have voted.
burkie's picture

You've got to get over this Deluded your the only one on here that thinks this way ,its like its becoming an obsession ,i wonder in 10 years time when we're three managers further on will you still be bleeting on about big Sam

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13 users have voted.
Deluded Hammer's picture

Blimey, you're pessimistic.

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13 users have voted.

He left an everlasting legacy - we are still playing Hoofball!

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9 users have voted.
hammer1980's picture

The thing that worries me most is that I saw the players disoriented and out of shape. Bilic, with all the respect I have for him, was unable to give the team a clue. It is true that a victory after the break could give confidence and reorganize the ideas, but in these three games I did not see anything good. And it is a problem that we are taking from last season. We were unable to make a good performance Saturday with Newcastle halved by injuries and zero points. I'm sorry to say so, but in these cases a coach change can do well

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18 users have voted.
asheshammer's picture

1. I've read all the comments from Slav and all the familiar excuses, including the favourite of the moment, "we started with four away games". GET USED TO IT -- The Stadium is going to be used in the Summer and West Ham will not have a say, despite what Brady says. Those were four crap performances, less about five minutes vs. Cheltenham. No excuse for that.
2. As many on this site have said, Slav may fluke it against Huddersfield, but he's not going to change the team or the set up or the tactics, and so it will revert back to the same thing. AND if he doesn't fluke it, we'll be gone by Christmas.
3. The Board are f'in cheapskates. Why keep Bilic when he is so clearly inept? Because it will cost them to fire him and hire someone like Benitez (if he would even come). Many people have tracked our net spending this summer and it really has been a pathetic reinvestment. If they sell Fonte too, which may still happen, they may be in the net gain territory. How utterly crap is that???

So I lay blame on Bilic for the team performances, and on the Board for not caring enough about West Ham to do what needs to be done. Sounds extreme, but the possibility of our famous club disappearing over the horizon, with a big empty stadium for Chumpionship football seems real to me.

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10 users have voted.

This is gona sound a bit confusing and maybe hypocritical, but I just read Liverpool are about to spend 183 mill before the window shuts! Yes money has gone out of control and yes it's not all about paying for players and yes I'd prefer our team to be built in a more traditional way, but I can't help thinking if we baulked at 40 mill for calvalho then the board had no right to say they are taking us towards champions league or even next level. Everything is now in place for us to start challenging these teams after the TV money and move and increased attendance.
As for bilic what difference will yet another 4 games make? He has had that chance last season, won a couple o games to save us. If there was to be any improvement after that, or lessons learnt we would have seen them! Still not fit despite it being a problem last season, still shipping goals for fun and still not playing any resemblance of decent football. If he is gona improve them long term he would have done that whilst in trouble last season. If he doesn't go this week, the whole thing us a waste of time. Bilic has proven his philosophy is too rigid to change us long term for the better.

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17 users have voted.
Deluded Hammer's picture

Really?? Have any of you actually met him or worked with him? He's too nice?? Where'd you get that assumption from?? A real Hammer at heart?? Eh?? He f**ked off to play for a bigger club as I recall. Only played 54 games for us. I TOLD you all this would end in tears when he came in. A couple of fluke away wins in his first season and woah "Super Slav". And as long as those clowns are in charge of this club it won't get any better.

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9 users have voted.

Must admit I've never understood why people think this guy gets us, is one of us or a hammer at heart. For me it's just made up nonsense.

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8 users have voted.
Dicks is the man's picture

i made the point long ago, about the back stabbing nonsense going to everton as they were in his opinion 'bigger' than us…they were relegation battlers if i recall in those days too. he was only interested in the money, which is fair enough for a croat with no affiliation to any english club back then…but we can't keep using it as an excuse that he's one of our own. doesnt matter anyhow, he's not paid because he's a former player..hes paid to do a job, which at the moment he's not doing. its all going a bit like zola all over again…lovely bloke, can't treat him badly….blah blah…yet he's just no damn good at managing the club anymore.

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17 users have voted.

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