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that is my thoughts about alex song in midfield and with obiang now getting some games and proving himself a better choice in the midfield I.M.O surely the board will not sign him on any kind of permanent deal....he simply has not done enough and the wages rumoured to be on can be put to better use....discovering the likes of lanzini shows that you do not have to go over the top on fees and wages to get a very very good player....sadly song is not any of these anymore...he switches off to many times for my liking and gets caught with the ball instead of making the pass....if his wages were halved and he was happy to be a squad player maybe then make deal but for £80grand+ he is supposedly on well he is not worth it.
Completely agree. He has been
Completely agree. He has been terrible since coming back from his injury ( apart from the Man City game ). I was absolutely fuming with him in the game against Soton away. We keep on talking how the inclusion of Lanzini and Carroll changed the reverse fixture in December but in truth at least from my point of view it was the substitution of the lagerly useless Song. Verdict - get him off and get a hungry your player who would give everything every single game. And can he please loose those ridiculous glasses.
Agree with you both!
Yep couldnt agree more...
I agree he's looking like
I agree he's looking like deadwood as well as Moses both in the last chance saloon in their career but play like they don't care about their careers. Before anyone mentions Moses on Saturday, one swallow doesn't make a summer.
I have to disagree
About moses,imo he hasnt had many chances to show his worth...
How many chances are enough
How many chances are enough then 65? He was a regular starter for months before Antonio was even considered.
I suppose im basing my opinion
On the games that ive seen this season Red!!though 4 or 5 home games in restricted view seating & dodgy streams at home are maybe not the best way to view things...& as people have pointed out imo antonio was pants on saturday!!
65 obviously neither song or
65 obviously neither song or Moses will be decided upon till the end of the season so they still have a bit of time and chances. For me Moses doesn't effect a game very often. He doesn't give the full back any real defensive cover and is mainly reluctant to take his man on with the ball at his feet. When confronted by the full back more often than not, he will stop, check and lay the ball back. Antonio has done far more in the games he has played which surely isn't far different to the amount Moses has (altho I admit I'm not certain) I couldn't get the stream up Saturday but it's very possible he was pants, but for me he is more effective and consistent than Moses. Anyway being curious if tomorrow was the end of the season and you had the money would you buy him for say 10 mill or go elsewhere? IMO I think the way we are going the club is looking for better than what song and Moses are giving us
Valid points Red!
I think it really depends on how much the daves are prepared to spend in the summer...Are we going to go for players in the 20 plus million bracket??The likes of sturridge,etc if so we would be looking at better players than moses & song...Is moses worth 10 million??good point i cant answer that!!especially bearing in mind todays inflated prices....
65 you don't get much for 10
65 you don't get much for 10 mill these days and I suppose players are like houses, they are worth what someone is willing to pay. IMO no one is worth 10 million but I'm old skool
Very true Red!
It wasnt long ago fulham paid leeds a reported 11 million for Ross McCormack,both clubs in the chumps,& hes remained in the chumps...so i suppose if you compare moses with that transfer then hes worth 10 mill...but im prob with you on the thinking "is any player worth 10 million??" Apart from payet!!;)
Sadly both are an example of
Sadly both are an example of what's bad in the modern day game....both very talented but you have absolutely no idea whether it's going to be Jekyll or Hyde that turn up at 2.59pm on a Saturday!!
The main reason for it IMO is that " they know somebody will always give them an in".
Promoted teams.
Teams desperate to get promoted..
Saudi Arabian teams.
The Chinese.
Moses is one of those players who will retire an incredibly wealhy man having never influenced a top class game in his life or made a consistent mark at a club.
Says it all about the modern day player and the game sadly.
We can only surmise the
We can only summise the reasons why they or anyone else are jeckell and Hyde the obvious thing for me would be the better you are the more consistent you are. Having said that both Moses and song I believe are/could be better players than they are so is it drive or motivation? Good post Spurs.
Yes I think " drive" very
Yes I think " drive" very much is Red.
Just reading a book by an ex player ( its all about his gambling addiction) through the late 90s and early 2000s and its very clear how much BONUSES played a part in a players earning ability back then.
Now?!
Well £100,000 a week if you win.
£100,000 a week if you lose.
Add to the fact very few of the modern day players are surrounded on a Saturday night by fans that are their mates or spent their " hard earned" watching that individuals performance that day.
Spoke to a pretty well known player several years ago and that was HIS EXACT words.
" I go out on a Saturday with my mates who are common football fans like you and have to work hard to afford to go to games".
Not too sure many of today's players will be out from the Ivory Towers of theirs after matches in this pampered era sadly!!!
I'm sure most fans would
I'm sure most fans would agree that players are so far distanced from the fans they can't relate to us, so maybe drive is only measured in passion for the game now? IMO that would explain one differance between Antonio and Moses. You can see the passion in Antonio when he plays whereas Moses isn't so evident.
Some players " want to play"
Some players " want to play" and I believe they would do so at a so called " lesser club" whilst for others " its simply about the money".
Unfortunately in today's game agents have a lot to answer to but any player with any nouse and a degree of backbone should be able to make good choices.
You make a good point re Antonio. Looks like somebody who will give 110% every time he pulls a shirt on ( ours or somebody else's).
It's the reason why much and all as I have my issues with Noble ability wise I have always loved his passion and commitment.
James Collins is another who comes into the same category.
And I'm willing to bet THEY DO have mates that are ordinary blokes and that they go out for a pint with!!!
Good points about noble and
Good points about noble and ginge. You can just see them propping up the bar as one of the locals act as one of the lads. Could some of this be blamed on the so called elite clubs stock piling players and as a result quenching those desires to play football? Looks at players like Lanzini, Collins, Payet and noble have more grounded roots for their football careers ATM but players like song and Moses have sat far too long playing for the elite clubs excepting they won't play more than 5 games a season. I always thought Moses at Wigan and palace was a different animal. Chasing a big club when you are doing well and happy at a smaller club has a lot to answer to.
Think there's a very good
Think there's a very good example in today's papers.
" Sahko crashes £200,00 car!!!
Sorry.....but who exactly is Sahko?!
Yes he's scored a few goals for us and at the end of the day if somebody is throwing untold wealth at him then he's not going to be foolish enough to turn it down.
But again I beg the question....what has he done in football to achieve such?!
Not for a minute saying he doesn't give 100%(+) but what difference has it made to him having to be in a successful side etc to attain such wealth?!
Or how many games he's played/ goals he's scored etc?!
I like sakho as a player he
I like sakho as a player he offers us a hell of a lot. Having said that I totally agree with what you are saying Spurs. 200,000 car! For me it's doesn't matter what he has or hasn't achieved it will never justify wages of A premiership footballer more so when you see some of the poor play by some of them. Money has become a virus that clubs are forced to pay just to compete. The offshoot of that is this pricing of games. I know we are going off topic a bit but, a large part of the TV package is the atmosphere created by fans, normal fans that sing, shout, chant and show passion. Paying unecessarily high tickets prices will isolate those type of fans from the match day game. Once the atmosphere goes the product wanes and so does the money as we play sterile games with sterile fans, as even the players that are passionate can't motivate themselves with nothing coming from the terraces. That means the players wages will be reduced. At what cost to the game in this country? I'm not saying this is an overnight thing but the games is being ruined by the greed of everyone. How much money is enough? Whether that be wages, transfer fees or tickets prices. For the future of the game FIFA should look at all three and put a ceiling on them to run in line with inflation. Without it a lot more clubs will go to the wall when the wheels will fall off. But I suppose expecting the governing body of football to do something about the greed in the game is a thing of dreams when they are run on corruption and greed themselves allegedly. That how I see it anyway.
I like him too Red I just
I like him too Red I just feel that players " have it made" now simply BY SIGNING a deal.
No pressure to " perform".
No difference financially whether the team is top or bottom of league.
In Europe or not.
You will never convince me that if you give somebody X for doing essentially " nothing" then they will give you 110% at every turn.
Particularly if there is always another mug waiting in the wings to repeat the process should you run out of patience and not play them!!!
Since I was a young boy ( a long long time ago) I travelled a round trip of nearly 200 miles to watch my favourite team ( including midweek and sometimes if it was a cup replay and going to Extra Time) not returning till 1am then having to get up for school/ work next day.
Now I stay in the same City as the team.....and I have been to see them 3 times in the last 6 years!!!
Most of that simply boils down to the fact " very few of the players play for the jersey" now!!
Of course the game will survive without me.
But I fear the day is not too far away when clubs will be putting up pictures of these stands with people superimposed on them and have to have a sound system with cheering on!!!
There is certainly no
There is certainly no pressure to perform these days, well outside of their own guilt maybe? Generally you are probably right about players not giving 100 per cent for doing nothing ( signing a contract) probably exceptions to the rule old school local lads like noble. Clubs are missing the point if it gets to playing crowd noise thro the tannoy. Saw a quote somewhere recently sums it up for me, "football is nothing without the fans". I have already witnessed crowd noise somewhere not even this season either, so I do believe I could easily happen. Great story about the travelling, football is mainly about the memories and experiences.
Blimey your on form spurs!!
Agree,& apologies if its again slightly off topic!!i meet lots of people who used to be season ticket holders,etc not just recent ones but fans that were regulars donkeys years ago.They dont want to know because of the pricing,atmosphere,etc...
Like you i used to go all the time when i was young,but that has diminished the older ive got!!
I havnt even considered going to the new stadium yet,as plush as it seems,we may not even be able to get tickets!!
The O.S may be the dawning of a new era,but will it be mainly full of die-hard fans or tourists??
Will wait & see...
Ditto 65 only I do want to go
Ditto 65 only I do want to go to the last game and the first game at o.s. My son has re sparked my interest after the disillusion of the allardyce years.
Id love to go to the last game Red!!
But family commitments prevent me from doing so...anyway being just an academy member id have no chance!!
I also thought about going to to the manure game 2nd last ever home game at the boleyn...but again i prob have no chance...And even if i could...there wouldnt be much loose change left out of 300 quid for 3 adult tickets!!im sorry thanks but no thanks!!;)
65 I'm hoping to go to those
65 I'm hoping to go to those 2 games but in all reality it's highly unlikely but will give it a go but am a realist.
IMO that commitment is
IMO that commitment is something that every team needs. As for the example about the difference between moses and Antonio, I think its much more then just the fact Antonio looks like he gives 100% and moses dont. Players like Antonio thrive on it as does Noble, because it gets the crowd going it also means someone like Antonio imo gets in to better positions and influence the game more. Even though he had a poor game and made a mistake leading to goal he never stopped trying to get us on the front foot and kept trying to get in to dangerous positions. Moses on the other hand doesn't have that commitment and therefore imo hes become a lazy player. Generally though, Antonio is much better than Moses and more consistent also. Also to anyone who said Antonio was poor a the weekend, he wasnt helped by how poor Enner and the linesman was. Moses had the benefit of Carroll and Emineke(Another one who did well despite his misses). Also how would you go about the midfield and forward selection at the moment? Apart from song i can see why reason to have different selections out of the likes of Noble kouyate and Obiang, along with Payet ETC.
I touched on this before Fred
I touched on this before Fred, I have no worries about having those midfielders but our improvement next year is to get the perfect balance in that area. I don't believe we have it quite right with the players we have on our books yet. We need a bit of cover for Payet and Lanzini. I personally think Payet is more beneficial when playing through the middle so when he and Lanzini Are out we need that quAilty cover. The main problem is getting the dm right. Obiang may work his way there next season but if not we need a disciplined quality player whose a leader to complete the balance. Which I don't believe we currently have.
Good post
There Spurs!!