Haller Criticism Unfair

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current season

In all honesty, I had to put this thread up to give Haller a bit of defence. He is a a very good striker, but as happens quite a lot with Moyes, he is currently a round peg in a square hole. Moyes isn't the most astute of managers and praise given to him usually is on reference to his boring stint at Everton with his records at Man Utd, Sunderland and that foreign club whose name escapes me right now being overlooked. Expecting Haller to mimic the play of Antonio (incidentally another round peg in a square hole) is akin to using a screwdriver to do the job of a chisel. You would expect a half decent manager to utilise the tools at his disposal and if not satisfactory then to work a way around it. In this case, to change the formation to suit the only recognised striker we have in a tactic that suits him, and yes, we do have the players that could work around it. Playing nine defensive players against a poor team like Brighton certainly isn't the way to go about it. I would like to add that it was Moyes in his infinite wisdom that allowed players such as Chicarito and Hugill to leave the club. Here's a little link to remind you of the player we actually bought, not the player Moyes has totally destroyed of confidence. Expecting the usual Allardyce dinosaur comments in response.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WfcBGZ95EBA

Whatever way you look at it

Whatever way you look at it deluded,and however much you try and sugar coat it,he is not performing in a West Ham shirt,if he was that good,and wanted to do more, he would do alot more and show signs of something,im not interested in any overhead kicks,a one off that was,i have wrote this so many times,but i will write it again......He cant dribble,he cant hold the ball,he loses the ball as soon as he gets it,if he does hold the ball for a second he passes straight to the opposition,he is easily bundled off the ball and falls down......Now if for arguments sake we had Messi join us,but wouldnt have world class passing and lay ons for him,you would still see his world class ability,with blistering runs,and fancy footwork,that would show his ability,and make goals happen,i rest my case.....With the donkey nothing like that is seen.

You lost me deluded

At the beginning 'Haller is a very good striker'....

Have to agree, unortunatley

Have to agree, unortunatley the system doesn't suit Haller, but for example look how hard Yarmolenko chased the opposition when not in possession compared to Haller.

Exactly Nev,it was plain to

Exactly Nev,it was plain to see,Lanzini was sharp also.

Then why start Noble in a

Then why start Noble in a position that would suit Lanzini or Benrahma?? Surely we needed to win that game last night, west ham aren't that good that they can rest players.
Yarmalenko only played 45 mins and he plays on the right, that's a big difference to covering the ground of a lone striker

I watched him in depth

I watched him in depth yesterday v Brighton. One of the worst efforts I've seen in a West Ham Shirt in my 52 years of supporting this club. Lumbering around half hearted effort at closing down the opposition defenders. I cant say pressing as that's taking it to far. Not winning one arial battle and ending up on his arse everytime he jumped. Constantly holding out his arms with a complaining gesture. For a big lump he's lightweight. He looks totally disinterested. Can you imagine if we had fans at the ground? If you think his confidence is low now, just imagine 60k plus fans giving him stick. Just aswell we are not at the Boleyn as he would be destroyed as the fans were so close. I've seen players get stick over the years, but he would be lambasted to within an inch of his life. He is toilet!!

I actually thought he worked

I actually thought he worked hard last night and showed some decent touches, as the OP says Moyes has destroyed any ounce of confidence in him by not playing to his strengths.
It does make me laugh, to a lot of fans a good footballer has to run around like his ass is on fire for 90 mins, and there's not many strikers that could score with the service Haller gets, i don't blame him for looking disinterested to be fair, he must be completely disillusioned!!

But he doesnt

Run at all that's the bloody problem!!

Hes disallusioned!!!!!!!!!

Hes disallusioned!!!!!!!!! Its enough to make you weep FFS!!!!!!

The problem is that people

The problem is that people are confusing laziness with being slow and not celebrating goals as lack of passion.

Whatever way you are looking

Whatever way you are looking at this fred,you couldnt really celebrate such attributes,as the way to in still fire into team spirit,can you.

Laziness

Slow & lack of passion is exactly what he possesses

It seems to be seen as a must

It seems to be seen as a must have 65,im lost with it mate.

The sad thing is

I've studied this guy in every game since hes been a starter.more than any other player in 50 years of watching westham I reckon...how any body can say " hes a very good striker" or even "a striker" is beyond me...its mentioned hes league 2 standard,I honestly believe he would struggle there especially up against more brutal defenders...he should never wear the shirt again,I was saying that 6/7 games ago,hes actually getting worse ffs

Obviously entitled to your

Obviously entitled to your opinion but in my opinion he has more ability than Antonio, he's just drained of confidence, a league 2 player doesn't score an overhead kick like Haller did

Drained of confidence

In a side that has loads of confidence? Sorry mate no excuse in my book

I know peoples opinions and

I know peoples opinions and all that,but fuck me,how you can say he has more ability than Antonio is beyond me.........65 mate,you must be feeling as i do with this,im totally floored with these comments about donkey.

I cant believe it either Essex

People are entitled to their opinions but feck me we must be watching a different player mate! Said it before Antonio scored an overhead kick against citeh with their defender right up his arse,Haller scores an over head kick,the only thing hes done in 7/8 games & he has more ability than Ants!!

Take away Antonio's pace and

Take away Antonio's pace and he's a much different player, 9 times out of 10 his second touch is a tackle, and let's be honest it was contract renewal time for him, he was exactly the same before his last contract was up, and then the next season he was shite, like all this Lanzini nonsense, suddenly he's the best player in the world because he scored a goal against Spurs, for the majority of his west ham career he's either been injured or ineffective, he's had plenty of chances at west ham.

So you are basically saying

You would rather Haller in the team than Antonio & Lanzini?

Not under Moyes no, although

Not under Moyes no, although i'd play him over Lanzini because he couldn't play as a striker. what i'm saying is Haller is a decent striker in the right environment, let's be honest any manager that picked Noble in that position again after the Chelsea game needs to look at themselves, especially in a home game against Brighton, you could put any top striker in that team and they wouldn't flourish with that midfield behind them.

So how do we play

To Hallers strengths? Im dying to know!

This is getting better this

This is getting better this is hey 65!!!!! Lol he hasnt got any strengths,the man cant stand up,let alone help the team,he may aswell not be on the pitch,you cant blame the team for one man,he has to take responsibility for his own actions,how can the team work round him,as you say mate we are dying to know????

Just a thought Mate

when he was at his last team he played in two up front with Jovic and they where a great pair. Wolves are putting in a loan bid for Jovic as he is having the same effect as Haller and not performing. Now I’m no mind reader but if we also put in a loan bid for Jovic do you think he would think to himself, mmm go to Wolves and try my luck or go to West Ham and join my strike partner. For me it would be worth a chance then if they produce there might be a chance to get Haller value up again.

He needs someone decent close

He needs someone decent close to him, it's no good lumping balls up front to him expecting him to work miracles without much support, he's a decent finisher, he needs decent service. I can't understand why he hasn't tried Benrahma just behind him or even alongside him, somebody with a bit of creativity.

Respect your view

But what about the simple basics? Bullying defenders - for the size of him he crumbles at the slightest touch.Speed - static & never anticipates a pass.dribbling like a modern day striker - has zero ball skill.Awareness in the box - no where to be seen...I could go on...

interesting debate

I think there's truth in all of the above opinions. I noted the first few games of Haller's career with is and his hold up play was exceptional. Control, turning, touch technique. Scored a few goals too. With Antonio playing close to him it worked very well. Something happened around November last year and he was never the same again. It was evident Moyes didn't rate him, but it's become Moyes has a touch of the Redknapps too - stubborn to the point of hurting the side to prove his point - see Benrahma being criminally underused.
Haller has not helped himself and he is lucky there are no fans. His demeanor must be infuriating for team mates.
I think it's unfair comparing Antonio. Totally different players.
It's light comparing Ian Wright to Denis Bergkamp. Both effective in their own way.
The absolute mystery is why Moyes hasn't seen that Haller can't play solo. His reputation at Frankfurt was made in a 3, him often dropping deeper and arriving later in the box for sidefoot finish.
I think the while thing highlights the car crash recruitment policy.
The most worrying aspect of all of this however, and something else that has actually hindered Haller further, is the selection of Noble. A player whose legs went 3 years ago. Expecting him to link play.
If Moyes is that stupid, it's worrying for the future. If it's a signal to players he doesn't rate of the bench, that's also worrying for the future.
If it's a case of "tough schedule of matches" see Villas manager after a draw at Chelski last night "I've never had to take a player off for being exhausted".
Unless we see Benrahma, Lanzini and Yarmo in most of the game tonight, we lose again.

Agree with that Dazza

When Haller first came I actually thought he would be a good player for us....then we started losing,slid down the table & anyone could see he didnt want to be here! Since then the bloke has been terrible,I would eat a massive slice of humble pie if he miraculously changed overnight!! It just isnt going to happen,ever!Benny,lanzini,yarmo I'd start all of them instead of the lump of lard like you say mate if Moyes doesn't then we lose tonight & against Everton

Well said 65,youve said it

Well said 65,youve said it all i cant write anymore than that,its pathetic all this talk bringing his mate in for him,may cheer him up,whether you play someone with him or not,he hasnt got what it takes for the premiership,he shows no quality whatsoever time and time again.

The absolute mystery is why Moyes hasn't seen that Haller can't

Haller can't play solo. When he had rare outings with The Beast up front we were terrific!!!

Play another striker alongside him

Obviously, Moyes in his wisdom has let two strikers go and not replaced them so that idea is out of the window as we have no other recognised striker on the books (Antonio is NOT a striker ). To play to his strengths imo would be to change the system (ie, utilise the tools in your toolbox) . I'd go for a 4-4-2 using someone like Bowen alongside Haller ( or even Lanzini) and have Benrahma and Yarma (or Snoddy) on the flanks with Souchek and Rice as the defensive pairing. Moyes, as ever, shitting himself at losing to teams like Brighton, Palace or their likes would never contemplate going for the throat of such teams and never has, such is his fear of adventurous footballers. For the record, I am in agreement that Haller is not playing well but, that is for the reasons I have discussed. I have to declare some amusement at the term of "donkey" when we had the likes of Carlton Cole at the club for an unbelievable 9 years and yet escaped such major criticism. Carlton wasn't just a donkey, he was a crippled one

I was no fan of carlton

But imo offered a damn sight more than le donkey

Thing is Chippy

Antonio has scored more goals and puts in a great shift,haller scored one overhead goal and a fearce shot against the blunts and Antonio has scored more goals and he is not a striker

If playing a different system

If playing a different system were the answer i think moyes would do it ,fact is hes playing with nothing but atacking players ,plenty of quality floaters into the box and he cant even get off the ground ,he's got no sense of balance thats why he cant drible with the ball and as for his sense of timing ,non existent, hes even late into the celebrations when a goal is scored

I think that

Sums up Haller....a floater! Lol

Lol!!!!!!! Brilliant 65

Lol!!!!!!! Brilliant 65 proper shit.

Burkie lined it up perfectly there

Lol....

In all of this debate, Haller

In all of this debate, Haller should watch one striker. Up from the lower leagues. I championed him for a couple of seasons, we even put a bid in. Ollie Watkins, now that is work rate, just watch the boy off the ball. He will be a superstar. Haller watch and FFS at least look like you want to try...........

its a great post Deluded!

well done buddy for starting a great debate.

The vidoe clip highlighted entirely the issue that old Bugeyes cant see. Hes a classic No10 and and not a striker.

Let me explain, IMO. All or most of his goals come from behind the ball and more importantly FACING THE GOAL! This is typical No10 and a midfielder. Not many are comfortable with the back to goal and this lad certainly isn't, his hold up play is poor and hes not at all physical.. odd for a big lad. This means we lose the ball 50% of the time and put midfield and defenders on the back foot.

My German work pals said that he needs a conventional No9 beside him as seen at Frankfurt. But, yet again we have round pegs in square holes!

Cheers Dartford

Its all about opinions of course, and while I can't deny Haller is not playing well it does bring to mind the number of players that are good players before they come here and yet when they get here just don't either get a fair crack of the whip (Hugill) or are just played out of their normal job spectrum and look lost trying to do a job which is alien to them. And Moyes seems to have big habit of doing this more than any other manager I can think of and I've been a supporter for some 54 years! Anderson is shot of all confidence, Fredericks is getting splinters, Benrahma can't get into the team, Lanzini is a fringe player, Chicarito was not the same as we all know he can be and Haller we are debating right now. The latest Moyes fiasco is his starting on Noble. WTF planet is this guy on?