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How do we play against Newcastle?
Playing on the break has worked well for us; trying to play more attackingly less so! What will be our line up for the game on Saturday, and how will Bilic try to have us play? We now have better width, and I'd expect Antonio to make his debut (not Moses as he hasn't played much), otherwise I can't see the personnel being much different for the Liverpool game -- not sure if Tomkins deserves to be dropped to bring backs Jenks (and does he deserve to be re-called?)
What seems vitally important is to gain an early advantage, but that entails risk.
What do people think?
Duh, I mean Monday of course!
Duh, I mean Monday of course!
"Your not sure if Tomkins
"Your not sure if Tomkins should be dropped"?!
Would you like to be dropped when you had played in a defense that won 2-0 at the Emitaes then won 3-0 at Anfield?!
And thats BEFORE considering it would be for a player who has been horrendous in both the other matches and been a major contributor to a lot of the goals conceded!!!
Im no massive fan of Tomkins at RB 9still think he gets done too often ball watching whilst the player he is supposed to be marking ghost into space and profits) BUT you cannot send out the message that a player who is playing really poorly is going to walk back into the team when he is fit/available.
I think its one of the quickest ways for a Manager to lose not just that players confidence but that of others as well!!!
Think its time to realise Jenkinson is actually quite a dangerous situation.
99% of "his best work" is done by trying to bomb forward!!
THATS NOT WHY right backs should be selected!!!
Their" number 1 asset" should be their defensive ability....his is not!!!
He looked "a better asset" last year simply because we had such a dearth of attacking talent.
Particularly in the wide area.
Hence his getting forward was such a welcome sight.
Now we require" something entirely different".
When we are trying to bed Antonio/Moses etc in the the last thing we need is the full back (and I include Cresswell in the scenario) to be standing toe to toe with the wide men.
They need to be where they should be AND DOING what they are supposed to do.
Actually brings a question about Cresswell as well?!
I think almost the same scenario is unfolding for him.
He spent a lot of his time at Ipswich using his forward prowess and similar for us last season.
This season when he has been asked to defend as his priority in the home games then its not been a great outcome!!
To his credit he has played in the 2 very good away wins but again he needs to ensure he can actually do the job HES EMPLOYED to do!!!
He is also one of our players whereas Im not sure what Jenkinson now is?!
an Arsenal player with a 5 year deal and I would hazard almost no chance of ever playing for their 1st team!!!!
Bizarre why the gave him such a deal but thats the madness of football for you!!!
I think the new contract
I think the new contract scenario is very similar to our own Scott Parker signing a 5 year deal before going to Spurs, I think it just increases market value, both Moses and Jenkinson did it pre season and I don't either will get near a starting 11 for Chelsea and Arsenal, I would think both will be sold at the end of this season, the long contract just gives more selling power
Possibly.
Possibly.
However IF Jenkinsons believes he "Arsenal material" (which he is a millions miles from) and he continues to turn in the kind of "performances" hes started turning in this season where does that leave him/them?!
I can see the method in your madness as if his contract was up then he walks for nothing and this way "they put him in the shop window " and hope to make a profit......but its a big gamble!!!
!Assuming" hes on £40/50K a week 9not unreasonable to think that) then IF he continues to play like he is doing then they could spend £10m/£12m on wages for him over the length of his contact AND HE COULD STILL WALK AWAY FOR FREE!!!!
Maybe its just been "a blip" his form this season......but to be honest I never found him anything othe rthan average at the best of times so the 5 year deal still puzzles me!!
I guess its similar in Moses case.
I feel he could actually be a real asset given a regular start and a manager who fully believed in him.
I also think he could be a player that the West Ham faithful could really take to (hope so).
I think both could be West
I think both could be West Ham players after next season, must admit I've not really taken much notice of Moses in the past, he's been loaned out a few times which I guess at least says he doesn't want to be bench warming, I think there are better right backs than Jenkinson though, particularly as they would probably want 7 or 8 million for him
Just about every winger in
Just about every winger in the game " needs loved" mate.
they seem to really need to feel wanted (not sure if its the fact they are left isolated out on the wing and need to feel part of something,lol).
They seem to really need to feel that they are not just "bit part players".
I thought what I saw of him at Stoke was pretty decent to be honest.
Youve already alluded to the fact HE SEEMS TO WANT TO PLAY (why it would be any different for any pro player baffles me I must admit) and he looks to have pace,power and an eye for goal.
Thats the kind of player that if they got off to a good start then who konws where it could end up (Im thinking Di Canio esqe here)!!!
Im not sure if players are looking at us now and thinking "MIGHT this be a big club in the years to come"?!!
Im really not sure re Jenkinson mate.
Its got nowt to do with his horror show again Bournmouth.
Ive said before many a time that when a full backs best asset is his ability to get forward then hes not really a good full back!!!!
Its also strange that it seems 1 of the positions in the game that theres a real dearth of talent in!!!
Be interesting to see who (if any) of the new boys starts on monday (must confess I dont know anything about Antonio at all) but there looks a real chance to play with genuine pace and width now.
I just hope hes taken these players in with a real plan of what his starting 11 is going to be most games.
"Rotation" is good and well but you need to know what is your best starting 11 when you need it.
at present it would be hard to guess what that might be (hes also got the added thoughts now regarding Lanzini scoring a couple of goals,Carroll coming back and Zarate reintroduced to the top team)!!
It'll be interesting to see
It'll be interesting to see how he sets the side up now, we have lots of quality options now, probably more than ever so perhaps he'll use the wide players in the home games and keep a more compact midfield for the harder away games, I think at home when the onus is on us to attack it's very difficult without any real width in the side, I would think Payet plus a striker is guaranteed home and away so the four in midfield made up from Noble, Kouyate, Moses, Song, Antonio, Obiang, Lanzini is going to be a difficult one to call, I'd imagine he'll keep Noble as captain in the side, Kouyate is also a cert for me, I think his determination and work rate is fantastic, he's now added a couple of goals into his game so for me he starts, Moses having come on loan would have come with the idea of playing so you could almost say when fit enough he's a starter as well, perhaps that three with Obiang holding?
Tough to keep everyone in
Tough to keep everyone in midfield happy now and real competition for places which can only benefit us. Once Song is fit, I see Noble almost surplus to requirements. You can't drop Kayoute as he's turning into a WH version of Viera and Song delivers so much more quality than Mark does. Putting him out wide is a waste of time as the boy has no pace so he becomes a bit part captain which is weird.
I agree with that mate I just
I agree with that mate I just don't want to be seen to knocking Mark Noble all of the time....for some reason though I don't see him being dropped and I think we'll have another captain on the pitch that isn't necessarily the best available player yet again
Yes you do you fibber.
Yes you do you fibber.
Totally agree with you spurs,
Totally agree with you spurs, both cresswell and jenks need to get their primary job sorted out which is to defend still not impressed after their game yesterday. Could this be the area bilic strengthens next season? No wonder there were rumours about corluka
It very much "could" and
It very much "could" and definitely SHOULD be Red.
BUT.
Theres a huge difficulty now finding any full back whos No 1 asset is their defending!!
Not sure why that happened but Im actually struggling to think of anybody in any team that it applies to!!
Gone are the days of the Gary Nevilles etc and it is SO STRANGE to think why it might be?!
At the end of the day its not rocket science...but something somewhere bizarelly seems to have changerd the philosophy of the art?!
I say our defence should be
I say our defence should be pushing up the wings right from the off; we're playing at home and need to assure the home fans what's in store for the last season...I have predicted a shed load of goals on Selco and WHTID. Forever the optimist...#COYI
2 games against top sides and 6 points?
So dropping Tomkins for Jenkinson would be a bad decision. Jenkinson's performance against Bournemouth was one of the worst that I have ever seen in a claret and blue shirt so why you would put him straight back in over Tommo is beyond me. Moses will expect to start and Lanzini will probably have to be the sacrifice, in my opinion, with Jelavic on the bench as fresh legs to replace Sakho in the last 30 minutes. Great to see better replacements on the bench to the past couple of seasons of Maiga, Cole and Nolan.
Do you really think Moses
Do you really think Moses will start? He has only played 8 minutes for Chelsea this season, and that in the Charity Shield game. Should he walk into our side? Is he even match fit?
The Tomkins question is a toughie, as he not a natural full back, and isn't especially known for his offensive abilities, is he now our number one right full back? But it's certainly nice to have options for a change! :-)
Maybe
I see your reasoning about Moses but I don't see it with Tomkins, as he looks like he has worked hard pre-season and subsequently has put in the performances to date. Solid back line with wingers attacking and options on the bench to change to Option B, better than seeing Maiga, Carlton and Joey O'Brien warming up on the sidelines!
cough cough
......:)
Hehe, Moses obviously WAS fit
Hehe, Moses obviously WAS fit! :-))
Do we start Kouyate? He will
Do we start Kouyate? He will have played 2 international games in Africa, and travelled over 20,000 miles, not getting back until late Wednesday (more likely Thursday). Some might say he is better suited to away games than to home games. Thoughts? I'm not sure how much Sakho has played for Senegal.
he scored in their last match
he scored in their last match
Yeah, reckon even I could've
Yeah, reckon even I could've nodded that 2-yarder in! :-)
Let's Hope he don't have to
Let's Hope he don't have to much of that Fanny LOL!http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-3226285/West-Ham-star-...
Yeah I saw her, Mooro! She'd
Yeah I saw her, Mooro! She'd wear him out! :-)
Yeah she wore Balotelli out
Yeah she wore Balotelli out if Kouyate form dips we all no why :)
I'd start the same 11 that
I'd start the same 11 that smashed poo especially the first half anyway,confidence in that team must be sky high right now,but what a lovly headache for bilic on the bench hope it's raining lol
I agree Moore, you could
I agree Moore, you could introduce Antonio second half, also Jenkinson, he hasn't become a bad player overnight. Just because he had an off-day against Bournmouth he is still a great player. It's great to have these problems!
Yeah i'm sure jenks is
Yeah i'm sure jenks is working hard to put that horrid day behind him jozi
Yeah moore 6 with a fully fit
Yeah moore 6 with a fully fit squad he will have headaches of the right kind. I believe the squad we have now allows for the time when we do have a few injuries we will still be able to put out a team that will get us good results. I still think it will take time before he knows what his best team is. The difference this season is we were hoping Andy Carroll would stay fit last year, now I think he is going to be a squad player. Don't get me wrong if he stays fit I think he can still play a big part. Very interesting times ahead.
Yep!well with this new
Yep!well with this new recovery and rehabilitation AC has completed under bilic if he pulls it off it will be nothing short of a miracle but wont hold my breath on that one
Beware of the red FFS!
Anthony Taylor taking charge of this game
Wow
So many questions.
Who knows?
Let's see.
It's a teaser for sure.
Sarcasm is the lowest form of wit I wholeheartedly agree.
...And the highest form of
...And the highest form of intelligence said Oscar! Not sure I agree... :-)
I agree DH but
I was spot on......Moses and Tomkins to start :)
Chelsea v Newcastle in 2
Chelsea v Newcastle in 2 weeks -- relegation 6 pointer! :-)
Great result ,but got to
Great result ,but got to admit ,I am not as convinced by the Newcastle performance as others seem to be. The performance revolved around our counter-attacking style, with us struggling to really dominate the match and have sustained periods of free-flowing football. We only saw 39% of the ball versus Newcastle, but had the most shots on target. Against Liverpool, we had 37% possession.,against Arsenal 38% possession.
When we have lost, we have seen more of the ball: 46% at home to Bournemouth and 70% against Leicester. What to make of this?Bilic is playing to the teams strengths,for sure,but what is he sacrificing?...possession football ,which enables a team to control the game. There is nothing wrong implementing good counter-attacking play when the circumstances call for it. Against Arsenal and Liverpool away ,I can fully understand the reasons,and I would expect the same system employed against Man Cty this Saturday
However,to use that style of play at home ,especially against average sides,allowing them to dominate possession and control the game to some extent ,doesn't sit well with me. While a team has possession they control the game...that is the point! On the technical side , ,I found myself frustrated by our sloppiness, our lazy balls, and our frequent loss of the ball....we are talking school boy errors here. For those who felt Bilic was going to bring a beautiful style of football of the style of Arsenal I would say that he has not delivered that.,well not yet anyway,early days ,I know. Yes, he has created an exciting team on the break, but the idea that we can dominate a game, hold the ball, and create wave after wave of attack ,not off the back of the opposition losing possession,that is not what I have seen.Still have concerns about the full backs,as as already been mentioned ,when the players are more noted for their attacking play then their defensive qualities you have to question are they the real deal.For me,...not convinced....,both get caught out of position far too often.I think Man Cty will really exploit this .I would sooner have a solid out and out defender,then one who tries to employ both aspects in his game. . This is not a negative rant,just an honest assessment of where the team is at.
Sorry some glaring
Sorry some glaring inaccuracies. "Whilst a team has possession they control the game" er no,they don't. Don't care what the stats were Newcastle had about 10 mins of real threat over 93. I think stats are deceiving. If a team knocks the ball side to side without threat and you let them, so what. I think you probably expect too much. Is the style better to watch? Absolutely. We play a lot on the floor, a lot more flair and pace. We try and play to feet but mix it when we have to. We're more patient and the pace we have means counter attacking is a better option for us to run into space. Personally I like it and think it will only get better.
You both make some good
You both make some good points. But we must remember it's a work in progress. We are playing much better football, even if we are doing it mostly in a counter-attacking style. To be doing this well, even taking into account the 2 home losses, is better than I expected. AND we've only played FIVE league games, lots of time to get even better.
P.S.
NOBODY has scored more goals than us in the PL!!! Can you imagine that stat in the last few years?!!