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Moyes-Did He Really Say That?

nevillenixon's picture
Submitted by nevillenixon on Fri, 16/02/2024 - 16:20

There's lack of ambition and then there's total defeatism, guess which particular standpoint Hammers manager David Moyes has adopted? "If we can pick up another FIVE or so wins this season, it will get us in a good position".

Really? What on earth is he talking about? Perhaps he was referring to his local Scottish pub team that he supports and sees with his Dad when the opportunity presents itself!

IF YOU DO THE MATHS , that means using Moyes' statement, Hammers would have a final points tally of around 51 points, which last season was good enough for 11th place, 3 places above where the club finished last season. 14th place was definitely NOT good enough for an aspiring 'top' team!

The Europa league victory of last season masked what was a truly horrendous final domestic run in and more of the same seems inevitable given the atrocious run of form Moyes is currently overseeing. What aspiring, let alone inspiring, manager wants a less than 50% win ratio? Not one to take a club of West Ham's size forward, that is for sure, would Poch, Pep or the Aussie have said that?

Surely there will come a time when someone close to Moyes, maybe even Mrs Moyes or indeed his son will take him aside and say "Look David, enough is enough, you are in danger of destroying your hard earned legacy at the club, it is time to go with dignity!" Will he listen? Well on the strength of his previous actions the answer will be an emphatic NO.

This would be a shame, but there is an air of inevitability about how things are going to end and it won't suit Moyes OR the club unless some sort of agreement can be reached. - Ed

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The curious incident of the team in 8th...

darrenharry's picture
Submitted by darrenharry on Fri, 16/02/2024 - 11:37

Well hello comrades.

I trust all is well in the garden of .org? certainly less muddied than that of our team and the seemingly befuddled view of our fans these last few months.

What a strange juxtaposition we find ourselves floating around in currently.

The world and his wife (and mistress) seemingly have an opinion and a firm belief, tossed into a melting pot of social media, sprinkled with mental health and topped with lashing of sarcasm. Add into this the growling number of podcasts or YouTube channels, all competing for advertising and clicks (anything to not do a real days work) and it can reach a deafening crescendo. You’ll be forgiven for not knowing which way is up (or down) these days…
Throw into this football fans tribalism, incredibly varied intelligence and supporters knowledge ranging from those who have been watching for 50 years+ and those that have been here 5 minutes, plus those (pesky) armchair fans from far flung corners of the world, and it really is the craziest time to try to reach a fair, balanced view of the current situation.
All have tried it. I have on twitter….but realised quickly that you have to remember humour is incredibly important, as is respect. I’ve been drawn into many an argument and realised the rabbit hole was becoming dangerous. Some people aren’t there for a debate, it’s about causing maximum confusion and grief.
So how to unpick this? Noone can really, but for what its worth, I’ve tried to contextualise my thinking below. You may not agree, and that’s your opinion and that’s just as credible as mine, but that’s what makes the world go round.
I won’t be referencing Sullivan and Brady, as we all know they should have gone a long time ago and will eat away like parasites until they are gone.
So.
David Moyes
So, for the most part, for me, an undoubted success. Top half finishes and a trophy. Irrespective of everything else, that, from this club’s history, is a top achievement. There have been some great results, some great journeys, some great buys, some excellent counter attacking footballing.
But.
And this is perhaps the crux of the argument for me.
But.
If we have a manager that has achieved this, has a trophy, has us in 8th, the fact there are “but” statements, from a fan base that for my 40 years of attending have been bereft of any meaningful cheer, the fact that word exists among a rational, balanced fanbase, in my opinion, speaks volumes.
And no, it isn’t because we’ve got above our station, it isn’t because we demand more or better. Far from it. I know no fan that believes we deserve to be top 6 or challenging for top honours, not really.
What I do know, from every game I attend with friends and family and speaking to people around me in the Sir Trevor Brooking upper, is that they are bored.
Bored to tears with what they watch, week in week out.
And that, for me, is the worst thing that could have ever happened to West Ham.
More than the stadium move, more than losing our best players.
Boring.
That’s a real killer.
West Ham, and when I first attended in 1984, was about fun. Attacking, 4-2-4, one touch, creative, ball playing defenders, keeping the ball on the ground.
Looking to score at every opportunity.
And of course, it always failed! But my god it was fun. Laughing at bad players, mistakes. Crying at bad players and mistakes. Pulling my hair out. But that was the point. You never knew what you were going to get (well, mainly defeats!)
But the buzz, the thrill. Beating the big boys, losing to the rest.
Now I know things move on. Times change. Owners change.
But what I’ve never seen is that fundamental basis of “fun” change until now.
What we now have, is a more cautious than ever approach from a manager that has caution intravenously delivered into his blood stream.
The first creeping of the fun reducer was the baffling lack of use of the bench.
So the rules allow 5.
You can have a total of 9 on the bench. So virtually a whole new team, and you can change half of them.
So that’s potentially 20 players out of the 25 you are allowed in a squad, can potentially be involved on matchday. So, 80% of your squad can feel involved to some degree. Push on in training, try to get the managers attention…
You can see where I’m going with this.
The lack of bench usage by Moyes has many catastrophic consequences in the modern game.
Firstly, it’s an inability to tactically change matches (that would mean having a plan B though so…)
Secondly, the first XI are driven into the ground.
Thirdly the 9 on the bench, get little or no time to change/influence the match or showcase their talent and show their worth.
It begins to build resentment from reserve players that they feel they could be challenging, it builds resentment toward the manager, and it will increase frustration, and cause a players to either try too hard and make mistakes, or not play their natural game.
And I feel that’s what we’ve seen an accumulation of in the last 18 months. Ex first teamers, being marginalised, but given no glimmer of hope or incentive to get back in.
The running joke was who would we see on 78 mins, Benrahma or Fornals…just so predictable, late and pointless. And that wasn’t because the first XI were doing so well. We were bottom half last year. Bowen went through a shocking loss of form, played every game, Soucek has been woeful for a huge amount of time, plays every game. Players know this.
We now have almost 40% of the squad looking to move away, or when they (ever) get on, know its almost pointless.
This means another mass squad rebuild in the summer. An aging squad. No youth brought through (despite them winning everything last year).
Oh hold on, he’s played Mubama a handful of times….no, doesn’t count does it…
This lack of production being trained through and rotating a squad that has good players in it, is, in my opinion, neglect.
Tactics.
Now here, I can’t really apply to much negativity, as we knew what we were getting here. It’s what he does, negate. His history is solid foundations, well organised and hard to beat. Everton were always beige under him. Punching above their weight.
However, even by his standards, we’ve retreated so far into our shell, the defence are holding the line just outside Stratford station.
Sure, the front 3, when firing and fit, are among the best in the league. But you cannot keep expecting your troops to win battles on scraps. Nor enjoy it.
The possession stats are important.
Because the game is football, not “negelctball”.
The league will find you out.
Form is temporary, confidence cannot be bought.
We now have a situation where when we have possession, we almost don’t know what to do with it.
Football is a rhythmical game.
Its tempo, muscle memory, fluid.
You cant keep turning the tap on and off.
As a result we go sideways, sideways, back. Forward, back, sideways. Long. Lose ball. Repeat.
Its boring.
It’s been the main mantra for fans groaning and becoming fed up.
This part is the complete antithesis of why I attend or watch football.
Was a time we used to be a lot of peoples second team, because we were fun to watch. Or at least pleasant on the eye, trying to play the right way.
No (real) striker. No (real) left hand side. Aging full backs and our best centre half cant run. A “midfielder” that plays every game but cannot pass.
We’ve brought in another midfielder to join the other 3 midfielders…
I just do not and cannot see the logic in any of these decisions.
I’ll be honest, that win away to Tottenham, was the first time I didn’t celebrate our goals. I was just dumfounded how on earth we had stolen anything. But the logical part of my brain was saying “you know this isn’t happening again anytime soon, no one gets this lucky, and who would we rather have of the 2 managers).
I know my answer.
Sure. We may or may not consolidate a top half finish.
If we win the Europa, I’ll have to re-evaluate all of my understanding of football! But I think I know the answer to that too.
Which would leave me staring at another season of Moyesball.
Boring.
And that could see me finally hanging up my scarf in terms of attending.
Bored.

More depressing news

Dartford Bhoy's picture
Submitted by Dartford Bhoy on Thu, 15/02/2024 - 03:39

iIguess some of you will have already seen this on Youtube, I stumbled across it recently.

Ronnie Stutter, was with West Ham academy until at 14 when Chavski stepped in, looks like a hot property which in fairness the lad would be wasted in our set up never getting a chance. Very quick and reminded me of Tony Cottee :o(

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pJeN21pLBXs

The end is nigh

mcbikeman's picture
Submitted by mcbikeman on Wed, 14/02/2024 - 11:31

It wont be long now fellow Hammers the club will lose Steiden in the summer Kudus Pacman Bowen looking for greener pastures which they will find but the club cannot replace them because of FFP and so the usual injury prone journeymen who thought there best days were behind them will be recruited on freebies or pay as you play we will slide out of the Prem and into championship obscurity finally putting to bed all this European and top six nonsense the media will be happy and we will finally have our club back the one we know and love.....of course none of it will be Sullivan/Brady/Moyes fault it will be the supporters and our need for "Frontfoot" football that caused it all...what a bunch of Wankers we are eh!

Embarrassing-Depressing-And That Was Just The Homebound Journey!

nevillenixon's picture
Submitted by nevillenixon on Mon, 12/02/2024 - 09:55

When the dust was settling on a truly disastrous home defeat against London rivals Arsenal, Hammers fans who needed to travel across London had to endure sharing the same public transport links as the 'full of themselves' Gooners fans!

It might have been OK for the players leaving in their smoked out SUV's and other luxury forms of transport including the blinged up VETO's much beloved by clubs and funnily enough undertakers.

Well for every man woman and child that managed to stay to the bitter end, the club should offer them FULL refunds for what they had to experience including their travel expenses. Some fans who purchased their tickets from ticket exchange paid enormous amounts of money to watch what in essence was a pub team playing their FA Cup tie against one of the Premier League's 'big boys'.

The only difference being that a Pub team would have shown more endeavour and that their manager would probably have resigned straight after the game.

Of course teams will have the occasional blip in form, but Hammers current malaise stems from a manager's deep, rooted refusal to change, both on the pitch and off of it. David Moyes HAS worked wonders for the club, but his single mindedness is now derailing ALL of his previous achievements.

The players also need to take a long hard look at themselves and perhaps look at all the young faces of supporters who have just persuaded their parents to part with their hard earned for a replica shirt with their favourite player's name on it.

Offering Moyes a new contract will KILL season ticket sales, the club might even use smoke and mirrors to drag things out past season ticket renewal dates. IF they do then fans on the much punted season ticket waiting list had better dust off their old contact details because there will be plenty of new tickets available! - Ed--

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bonjour

darrenharry's picture
Submitted by darrenharry on Mon, 12/02/2024 - 00:16

Well.
What a time to be alive...
European champions and top 8...
Absolutely beautiful scenes...
Oh...hold on...
What, you're still not happy?
Jesus wept...you lot are priceless...
Oh...hold on...
You want want good football too?
Pass and move? Attacking? Positive? Using youth team playera that have won everything?
What the actual fuck is wrong with you?
Christ alive
Give me low block and Soucek and remember where we belong.
Well played Arsenal. Proper team. Handsome manager.

Now Live West Ham Utd v Arsenal Line Ups

nevillenixon's picture
Submitted by nevillenixon on Sun, 11/02/2024 - 13:03

West Ham: Areola, Coufal, Johnson, Zouma (c), Aguerd, Emerson, Ward-Prowse, Alvarez, Soucek, Kudus, Bowen. Subs: Fabianski, Cresswell, Phillips, Mavropanos, Ings, Ogbonna, Mubama, Scarles.
Arsenal: Raya, White, Saliba, Gabriel, Kiwior, Rice, Odegaard (c), Havetz, Saka, Martinelli, Trossard. Subs: Ramsdale, Cedric, Walters, Bandeira, Elneny, Jorginho, Nelson, Nwaneri, Nketiah.

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New Blood Or Same Old?

Submitted by Louis Nixon on Thu, 08/02/2024 - 09:59

The above is just one of the questions season ticket holders will be asking themselves when it comes to renewal time. On the face of it, renewing is a no brainer, serial Euro contenders and a squad to die for, albeit painfully thin!

The problem is football ISN'T PLAYED ON PAPER! Statistically, fans have never had it so good, but the manner in which results have been achieved is painful, terrible on the eye and hard to be enthusiastic about.

There are many who say the atmosphere in Stratford is dreadful, but that is NOT because of the stadium lay out, everyone knows it needs improving, it is because of the utter dross being served out as 'entertaining' football.

'Goofball' more like, even Moyes' most ardent supporters must admit that his particular 'brand' of football can be unpalatable at times, but that the results justify his team's cautious style of play, but how many of them make the trek across London to the Stadium itself?

Of course there have been highlights under the lights, particularly against European opposition who have not researched how single minded Moyes is! The fact is while the team DOES spring the odd surprise result, it spends the rest of the time making teams like Bournemouth and Brighton look like Barcelona in their pomp.

IF there were a fresh crop of youngsters being 'bloodied' for future campaigns then perhaps fans would be more forgiving, but as it is Moyes appears more intent on keeping his job by pointing to the data achieved under his stewardship than working towards the future.

A future that involves bringing youth through early, not just when there is a crisis, what ever happened to the 'Academy of Football'? Furthermore Moyes' propensity for buying old has beens has really hurt the club and is directly at odds with the remit Tim Steidten was given when he was brought in to over see transfers.

Moyes appears to be doing his absolute damnedest to obstruct Steidten and is blatantly trying, to shove Steidten to Hammers rivals Liverpool who DO recognise the German's brilliance.
If Moyes stays then Steidten will end up at Anfield, and why wouldn't he?

New Blood Or Same Old?-Ed

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